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Bronson

Grand Theft Auto V: The Sum of all Peers

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Well said.

And it would be great if there were more real consequences in GTA ( as well as more RPG elements ). This would only immerse you more into it's world.

The simplest way of showing this is looking at level maps from games 10-15 years ago and comparing them to now. Levels are much more linear and you may only have two (maximum of three) paths to mission success.

Then I compare this too the crappy Call Of Duty's that we have today. Where the Single Player is a linear corridor with no alternate routes, and dumb AI enemies ( who are no challenge at all/ even on higher difficulties ). And the same shoot this/ blow this thing up gameplay, and I think how has FPS gameplay degenerated this badly? In the end you're just sitting through a boring B Grade Action Movie.

So I look to more open-ended games like Fallout, MGS, GTA, Red Dead, Mass Effect or TES. Or great games that even though they're linear still have great gameplay and tell a great story, like Uncharted, Bioshock, Max Payne, The Last Of Us, Portal 1-2, Hal Life 2 etc

Well said. If a game cant provide great open world gameplay or allow replayability through choices (E.g Fallout) then there should at least be a gripping plot and not generic Russian terrorist threatening to blow up the center of the earth or something.

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I agree with you, sort of. Many games do seem to focus more on big cinematic events rather than having a natural and organic experience. I think the problem really started as developers started trying to outdo themselves. For example, there was the screen in COD4 with the nuke, which was amazing at the time, but then developers felt like they needed to top those kind of things in every new game. The result are these forced situations. As for the on screen prompt thing, that was interesting when they first started doing it, but I think it needs to stop.

I disagree, however, about games being increasingly lineal. That is probably more of a perception then a reality (and maybe a little nostalgia). What is happening is that games are doing things to create the illusion of a non-linear game, but in reality, they are just as linear as ever. I also disagree that doing things like restricting quest to people of a set level in RPGs is that same thing as making a game linear or forcing the player into something. There needs to be some restrictions in order to narrative to work. There also needs to be something to work for so that the game feels rewarding. I am concerned that younger gamers are only interested in instant gratification and do not have the patients to sit through a game and work towards something.

Some of the games that are filled with more narrative and storyline are actually very good. LA Noir for example is more movie then game but I still liked it. I am hoping that we will start to see a shift in the industry so that we will actually have video games, which are more like GTA, and then there will be interactive movies more like LA Noir. They each have their value and I hope both will be around for a while, right now I think the industry is still trying to figure it all out.

Regardless R* does do a great job at giving the player what they want how they want. It is one of the reasons why they are probably my favorite gaming company. There are a lot of games out there that just not all that impressive and this next gen is failing to impress me the way I would have hoped. Lucky R* doesn’t seem to be going anywhere.

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I agree with you, sort of. Many games do seem to focus more on big cinematic events rather than having a natural and organic experience. I think the problem really started as developers started trying to outdo themselves. For example, there was the screen in COD4 with the nuke, which was amazing at the time, but then developers felt like they needed to top those kind of things in every new game. The result are these forced situations. As for the on screen prompt thing, that was interesting when they first started doing it, but I think it needs to stop.

The real reason why Call of Duty started to suck ( after MW2 ), was because Jason West and Vince Zampella ( the main talent at Infinity Ward ) were fired by Activision due to a dispute involving "breaches to their contracts", and acts of so called "insubordination" ( it was rumoured that they were in discussions with EA at the time/ which could be the real reason ). Anyway they left and took almost everyone at Infinity Ward with them ( all the talent ), and formed their own independent game development studio "Respawn Entertainment". And every gamer on the planet should know about their first upcoming game "Titanfall" by now. So expect even more great games from this studio in the future ( there is a lot of talent there ).

And this is why Modern Warfare 3 sucked, because they didn't have any talent left at the studio, and decided to just use what was left behind by the old Infinity Ward team. And it's also why Call of Duty Ghosts will almost certainly suck as well. And as for Treyarch, they have always been the sub-par COD Devs, they can't even improve the Zombies component of their game. I mean why don't they add pro perks for the perk machines, or let you pack-a-punch your guns twice or three times, to extend the longevity of the game? No, instead they just regurgitate the same crap, and build a bunch of small maps joined together, calling it innovative ( Tranzit is shit ).

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I'm going to be extremely disappointed if the driving is TOO easy..

agreed, the idea of midnight club los angeles is a influence on the driving has me worried it may becaome a drift all the corners affair, which i will not like

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Was going to start a new topic but then I thought better of it. we cant have a new topic for every new article.

New article from IGN,"Grand Theft Auto V: Conflicting Points of View"

talks about 2 new missions. there are of course minor spoilers so if you are spoiler sensitive you might want to avoid it.

http://www.ign.com/a...-of-view?page=2

the author also brings up a good point that is along the same lines as what you were talking about DuffMan:

Okay, it’s time for a minor confession. I died quite a few times while playing missions described above, but that’s not down to <a class="autolink" title="Grand Theft Auto V" data-cke-saved-href="http://www.ign.com/games/grand-theft-auto-v/ps3-20594" href="http://www.ign.com/games/grand-theft-auto-v/ps3-20594">Grand Theft Auto V</a> being unreasonably difficult. Nor am I terrible at games – really, I’m not. At the time, I thought it might be due to all the new controls and mechanics I had to learn. But then I thought more closely about the moments in which I died. What did these passings have in common? It was when I hesitated, when I didn’t know where to go, and I’ve concluded that fault lies entirely with me. Admittedly, GTA V doesn’t tell you where to go, but that’s the point. You can go anywhere. I died when I lacked both imagination and conviction. You see I’ve become awfully lazy when playing games that involve shooting and driving; I’m content to be pushed towards a mildly satisfying objective. So when I landed on the beach with Lamar, and he suddenly looked towards me for guidance, like a child who got mixed up in something he didn’t fully understand, I was overwhelmed. I could go anywhere, get away by any means I could find, but I died right there on the sand because I’ve grown acquainted to games that consistently underestimate me.

that is absolutely true, I have found myself becoming increasingly lazy with games. it is not so much about linear or non-linear, it is about developers thinking you are to stupid to figure it out.

</p><p>The real reason why Call of Duty started to suck ( after MW2 ), was because Jason West and Vince Zampella...</p><p>
Yes, that is a specific reason that MW has been going down hill. I was talking about gaming in general.
Edited by calimann83

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I too am worried about the driving. It was the one and only thing that I was a bit "uhh fuck" about when I saw the trailers. It looked way too easy and really arcade like. Cheap. I pray it will be fine as it will spoil the game slightly in my opinion.

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The driving mechanics will be better than they have ever been before.

I don't know why everyone is so worried, to me it looks great so far. Just wait and see how refined it is when compared to previous GTA Games.

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Well if you think about it, all the driving we've looked at would be from a R* employee who has had some practice already so my theory as to why the driving looks easy is because well, they just made it look easy.. Same goes for the shooting mechanics, in the gameplay vid, when Franklin was ripping through those guys, it seemed so quick and swift when in reality it's probably because the R* employee has played the game quite a bit..

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not too mention when they set up the trailers, they did so knowing what type of scenes to show. storyboards. So some of those scenes were done to the best that they could be done over and over. like the target practice scene. As for the driving scene, they probably just recorded for a few days and took the best 1.3 second clip that was thru heavy traffic in a case/race style set up. i have faith that shit's gonna be just fine in every aspect. they said shit is different so give it a few hours to get used to it,and how it feels, and i'm bettin everyone's gonna be just groovy with how it all is. well....i hope anyway, lol.

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if what i read is true the driving and flying skills are back, so with all the driving they have done they could also have a slightly easier time that way.

Your correct. Over time your driving and flying skills will improve like San Andreas. @otiz- That seems to make most sense that they would just replay that specific driving seen till they liked it, and plus they're the ones creating and modifying every aspect so it makes sense for them to be really good at it to make it "look" easy to us.

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@Bmw>yeah i had thought that was more than likely about that driving scene too, but then thought maybe it might'a just been easier to drive around doin cool shit for a few hours recording, to get the best angle. and went with that clip. but if they were worried about what the background was showing then yeah, i'd say they redid till it was mastered also. regardless, gonna be fun....

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Well said.

And it would be great if there were more real consequences in GTA ( as well as more RPG elements ). This would only immerse you more into it's world.

The simplest way of showing this is looking at level maps from games 10-15 years ago and comparing them to now. Levels are much more linear and you may only have two (maximum of three) paths to mission success.

Also I couldn't agree more with this statement.

It reminded me of the old FPS games I played in the 90's ( before COD ). I remember playing the old "Medal Of Honor" games on the 'PS1' ( and Goldeneye on the '64' ), and having multiple ways of going about the objectives I.E. Multiple paths and multiple ways of approaching the enemy ( "Stealthily" or the "All Guns Blazing" approach ). It also let you infiltrate enemy bases using a disguise and a fake I.D. Plus you could find higher level clearances for different areas in the game, and if you didn't have the right papers to be in an area, the guards would run and set off an alarm, sending waves of tough enemies at you from multiple directions ( you could also disable the alarms yourself ). Plus the enemy AI had half a brain and put up a decent challenge ( shooting Nazi Helmets off was fun with the great sound design "PING!"/ And then him looking around all surprised to see where the bullet came from/ and then screaming in German at you when you're seen ). ( there was even a level in a German Castle where some of the Knights Armour ( decorating the place ) actually had people in them, and they would attack you once your back was turned ( making a heavy metallic sound as they charged at you/ they could kill you pretty quickly as well/ which made the level even more exhilarating ). Where did great original ideas like these go?

Then I compare this too the crappy Call Of Duty's that we have today. Where the Single Player is a linear corridor with no alternate routes, and dumb generic AI enemies ( who are no challenge at all/ even on higher difficulties ). And the same shoot these guys/ blow this thing up gameplay, and I think how has FPS gameplay degenerated this badly? In the end you're just sitting through a boring B Grade Action Movie.

But there are still plenty of great open-ended games like Fallout 3/ New Vegas, MGS 3/4, the GTA series, Red Dead Redemption, Mass Effect 1/2/3, The Elder Scrolls Series, Far Cry 2/3, and the Batman Arkham games ( to an extent ). Or great games that even though they're linear still have great gameplay and tell a great story, like Uncharted 1/2/3, Bioshock 1/2/3, Max Payne 1/2/3, The Last Of Us, Portal 1/2, Hal Life 2 etc

Many stealth games use the "you can do it smart or charge in guns ablazing approach." Also, linearity isn't a bad thing at all, in my book.

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^ I'd say a linear story works well for certain genres as they create a strong narrative but in an open-world game like GTA? No thanks, I wanna do whatever the fuck I want, whenever I want, and decide how I wanna do it.. The more possibilities the better imo..

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Many stealth games use the "you can do it smart or charge in guns ablazing approach." Also, linearity isn't a bad thing at all, in my book.

Both Linear and Open World games have their place in the game industry ( and both types can be good in their own ways ).

But personally, I would always take an open world game filled with tons of choice and consequences over a linear game any day.

And in regards to what I was talking about in my earlier post, I was referring to the Single Player components for the top FPS games of this generation, such as Battlefield, Call of Duty, Halo, Resistance, Killzone etc. And the first 3 franchises in that list are very influential on the rest of the game industry, because of the money they bring in and because they spawn a lot of imitator games of lesser quality.

The developers for these games will probably be trying to keep replicating their success, and so will follow the same formula without trying to change or innovate future games for fear of scaring off the large fan base that they have built up. This causes things to stagnate and become mediocre in the FPS market ( which is already dominated by casual players ). Which I think will cause more hardcore gamers to gravitate towards other types of games ( like third & first person RPG's ) once they see the quality that is on offer with the new Western RPG's that will be developed next-gen ( like The Witcher 3/ Fallout 4 & Next-Gen TES ), and to open world games with RPG elements ( such as Watch Dogs & The Division ).

So I guess what I'm saying is that in the "Next-Gen Game Cycle" ( Xbox One/ PS4/ PC ) FPS games will still be a major part of the market. But other more open games will come to be more appreciated by a larger portion of the gaming community.

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